10 Questions You've Always Wanted to Ask a Terrorist Defense Lawyer

There are two main reasons why lawyers often turn down terrorism cases. There's usually not a lot of money involved—one stereotype of a terrorist here is that they're low-income, though recent cases have shown that this is not always the case anymore. And defending a terrorist can reflect badly on a lawyer's career, as is the case for the members of the organization for Muslim lawyers called Tim Pengacara Muslim (TPM).

These reasons aren't enough to discourage Asludin Hatjani. For the past two decades, he has defended hundreds of terrorists including those involved in the Poso con and the string of suicide bombings carried out by Jamaah Ansharut Daulah (JAD). Because of this, Asludin's career has not always been smooth. Some prospective clients have avoided him or stopped working with him after they discovered his client history.

"I do defend terrorists, but not once in my life did I ever follow their beliefs," Asludin told me. "They always tell me their ideology is based on the Quran, but I’m still not sure what they believe in."

Recently, I met up with Asludin to talk about the first time he's ever dealt with a terrorism case, how he eventually garnered a reputation of a "terrorist attorney," and how if affects his career.

VICE: So what made you decide to represent alleged terrorists in court?
Asludin Hatjani: I started in 2000 during the Poso conflict in Central Sulawesi. During the conflict, many Muslims were arrested. I grew up in Palu, so I knew what really happened there. I decided to defend them in court. From there, my colleagues and I formed TPM. The first terrorism case I handled was the pretrial hearing against the provincial police HQ of Central Sulawesi for arresting 29 Muslims without following the proper procedure. We won the pretrial and they were released.

Why do you want to defend terrorists?
Everyone is entitled to legal aid no matter what. Everyone deserves to be defended in a fair trial.

How many terrorists have you represented so far?
I’ve handled hundreds from cases in Poso, Sumatra, Ambon and Java. Some of them are well-known, like Umar Patek from Jemaah Islamiyah (JI), the convicted Bali bombing terrorist. Then there are Abu Dujana, Abu Tholut, Ustadz Harits, the leader of JAD Jakarta. My most recent client is Aman Abdurrahman.

People say terrorists are not always Muslim, so why did you form TPM?
I’m not a religion expert. We formed TPM not because we support terrorism and justify what terrorists' actions. We work based on facts. In every terrorism case, I want to see what the motives are. Did the suspects really want to do that? Or did they misunderstand what they’ve learned? I won’t choose sides. But if there are casualties, then they're obviously wrong.

Watch: This Indonesian School Is Deradicalizing the Children of Convicted Terrorist

You’re the defense attorney of Aman Abdurrahman, spiritual leader of Jamaah Ansharud Daulah (JAD). What were the challenges you faced in court?
It may have been the toughest trial I’ve ever been to. Throughout the trials, there were a series of attacks in East Java and Riau. I was certain that it would affect the prosecutors. And I was right. Aman received death penalty. My only strategy is to focus on the evidence revealed during trial. We could see that there isn’t a single witness saying that Aman directly instructed the terrorist attacks. The masterminds of these attacks were JAD regional leaders.

What’s the biggest and most difficult cases you’ve ever dealt with?
Besides Aman’s case, probably Umar Patek’s. His case was a tough one because he’s the one who assembled the Bali bombs. He could've gotten a life sentence. My job was to make him realize what he did was wrong. And he did. So at the end he was sentence with a 20-year imprisonment.

There are terrorists, like Aman, who refused to be represented by an attorney. How did you approach them?
After they get arrested, I come to see them. I talk to them. Once I have their trust, I'll tell them that I'll do my best and work with the existing facts.

You don't ask for money from the terrorists you represent. How do you put food on the table?
I also handle cases that have nothing to do with terrorism. Otherwise I wouldn’t have been able to make ends meet. In the past, many clients canceled our contracts for whatever reason. But I moved on. I understand that they just had different perspectives. That still happens today, but it's OK. I have other clients who still trust my professionalism.

How does it feel to be called a "terrorist lawyer"?
I see no problem with that. To be honest, it's helped my career. I get a lot of attention when I handle big terrorism cases. That's how new clients hear about me. It helps me financially.

How are terrorists like—at least when they're talking to you? Are they "human" at all?
Yes, they’re still human. Many regret their actions, but there are also some who still strongly hold their views. Umar Patek’s case is the most memorable one for me. We're glad he realized his wrongdoings. He’s sad, and almost cried, as he learned how many people killed in the Bali bombing.